2G, 5G & 6G Help required

[lou2u]

Gidday 🙂

My names lou am new to the forum I tried posting on another thread but got no replies so thought id try starting a new thread and see how I go.

Not long finished my Trade as a mature age apprentice and have decided to become a certified welder specialising in Tig/Stick

My goal is to  become a pipe welder and develop the skills to pass 6G and 6G restricted weld tests on the spot so i can get onto high paying construction projects etc etc

I will start with my 2G 

Ive been practicing my 2G for about 5 weeks now n heres what ive been doing:

Method: I freehand root and cap & walk the cup for hot and filler passes

Material practiced on: 3 1/2 inch 6mm Mild steel pipe

Setup: Metal cleaned up to shiney 20mm from edge of bevel inside and outside of pipe; Landing approx 2mm, Root Gap 3mm, coupon tacked @ 120 degress in 3 places tacks no bigger than 12mm. Coupon is setup in a pipe fixture and purged with Argon………….No 10 Cup with Gas Lens been using 1.6 tungsten on root and cap 2.4 on the rest eg hot pass and filler runs……………..Gasmark 12-14

Settings: Root & hot pass approx 106 amps, Filler passes and Cap approx 110 amps

At this stage i am totally nailing my root and hot passes peno is great and am consistently now getting at least 1mm of inside reinforcement Im feeding the 1.6 rod slightly north of the root gap for about 3 seconds then doing a slight back and forth motion with my tungston n seeing a slight keyhole  before my next dab. I buff with a power wire brush between runs but dont touch the cap.

Ive been welding the rest out including the hotpass with a 2.4 tungston I walk the cup for the hotpass (the theory is that this will help me warm up for my 5G) and any filler runs then freehand the Cap.

My problem is I seem to be doing to many filler runs after my hotpass and Im getting a slight bit of overroll on the cap. By this i mean when you look at my cap the northen part of my bead has less reinforcement than the sourthern part of my bead

Passed my 1st Nik break n bend test but want to fine tune my 2G

Have just started practicing 5G @ this stage Setup is the same as my 2G will do another post on 5g soon

My teachers at TAFE arnt allowing me to weave or walk the cup on the cap they insist that i freehand Im happy to do this as I want to learn as many techniques as possible……………………

Any tips or advise muchly appreciated particularly in regards to optimising the apprarence of my capping runs…………..

Regards Lou

[Flash]

Hey Lou
you sound like you are right on the money, good work
I agree with the lecturers preferring that you do not walk the cup, but I do think they should let you weave or stringer based on personnel preference

as for your cap, it will always tend to do that
a few things you can do is do a weave in this fashion //////// not IIIIIIII by weaving backwards it creates a shelf of solidified metal at the bottom of the prep for the liquid metal to sit on at the top and it stops gravity taking affect ie overoll (you have to do this freehand)

something else you can try is fill the groove more at the top than the bottom (before capping) therefore compensating for the cap which will droop a little

PS another tip no one I know changes tungsten size mid weld without a very good reason and what you are doing does not satisfy that criteria 

Good luck 

[lou2u]

Thanks for the reply i really appreciate it! and love the solid honest feedback!

When I first began my 2G I started with a 2.4 electrode and around a 1.6 root gap and wasent getting much penetration when i swapped over to a 1.6 electrode and pulled the rootgap up to 3mm I started to get good consistent results. The idea behind the electrode swap and thus fillerrod was that the weldpool would be a little less fluid and i hoped this would help reduce the overroll effect caused by gravity………………….?????? Also if i dip a 2.4 tungsten into the weld pool it feels less likely that I’ll leave some tungsten behind.

I also though it might help me build up my hot and filler passes before I cap @ the moment the entire weld is taking me 9 passes which feels way to much????

How many passes should i be looking to complete the weld in??? My instinct is telling me the less the better and probably means I have to feed way more wire into the weld pool during fill n capping runs????

IS it worth trying out s4 or s6 filler rod im presently using s2?????????

I’ll try welding it out with 1.6 filler rod and electrode tomorrow

Thx again

Regards Lou 🙂

[Flash]

I would use a 2.4mm electrode all the way, I often use a 3.2 for pipe particularly sch80 and above, I only use 1.6mm on really thin tube even then very rarely

the electrode diameter (within reason) will not affect your pen, the angle you sharpen it can, but 2.5 x diameter long taper is ok for this

I would also use 2.4mm wire all the way, use S4 it is better then S2 for this application in my opinion, it flows better

set your gap up with a 3.2mm piece of wire by time you tack it, it will close to 3mm

9 runs, man way too much, I would do 80NB sch 40 in 3, even 100NB sch 40 in three
you need to force more filler wire in there, no wonder you are getting overoll, the pipe is most probably cooking by time you cap it

you need to pass the test but you also need to be employable, if you do 9 runs on a test for a job (unless written on the WPS) you would not get far, do it in 4 max root, fill, split cap,  I would do root fill and weave cap (you might need to let it cool a little)

your amps are lower than I would have, but if you are learning that is OK,

I use to teach my guys the fire and ice rule, to prove a point I did a root on a 2G 100NB sch 40 at 300amps (I do not suggest you do this), how do you do this, add heaps of wire, think of the arc as if it is the fire and the wire as it is the ice the more ice you add to the fire, the cooler it gets

GTA is different to MMAW, FCAW, GMAW in that the filler is independent of the arc

your 100 amps most probably look hot because it is not doing anything (not melting any ice) force some wire in there

Use welding gloves and get used to them, ditch your TIG gloves (unless working on fiddly stuff), you will never go back

Good luck
R
Flash

[lou2u]

Gidday 🙂

Thanks for pointing me in the right direction your suggestions are invaluable!!!!!!! I’ll apply the good oil tomorrow and let you know how i get on. I’ll try to remember to take some pictures so that you can see whats happening…………

Just to get me in the Ballpark what Amps would you be running at?????

Regards Lou

[Flash]

when you are starting 130-140 should be fine, when you are starting get it under control then keep increasing the amps each week, to get it as hot as you can handle
back it down for the cap, if you want to get it really neat
R
Flash

[lou2u]

Gidday

Im 5 weeks in and this is what im starting to consistently pump out. im at about 110 amps for the cap and it definitely looks as though I need to be hotter………………

These welds were done in about 7 runs I was just over flush with 4 but the welds had a really cold look so i ended up capping with an additional 3 runs which pulled it out to seven! totally agree that this is way to much!

At this stage im pretty happy with the peno presently around 106 amps…………..

Obviously need to start tuning things in till im happy with the appearance of the welds (At this stage im not) Unfortunately down with the flu and havent had a chance to apply your suggestions

Regards lou
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[lou2u]

Gidday

Applied your suggestions ramped up the amps by 20 and stuck with 2.4 electrode and S4 Filler rod. The improvement was immediate Just need to finetune my Peno which is outta control at the moment!!!!…………..

Should i be feathering my tacks????? Im having a bit of difficulty with my tie-ins

Will post a few more pics as i approach test day so you can see the progression !!!!

Thx again your suggestions have been invaluable!!!!!

Welds completed in 4 runs then 3!

Regards Lou
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[lou2u]

Gidday graham 🙂

Just wanted to let you know that I passed my Cert 7 with flying colors. On the day myself and 4 other welders passed 2 Tig kids and 3 stick fellas all on pipe 2G n 5G
Whooooooooooo Hooooooooo
A big Shoutout to all the RIT boys who got through with me on the Day!

Regards Lou

[Flash]

Great News Lou
congratulations to you and the lads
consider this a start if I was you I would
try and get some more certificates 3E, 4, 8G/F
and also keep ramping it up with the TIG,
keep trying to turn it up with the amps,
keep trying other things like,
put the pipe into a restricted position like 6GR or put it close to a wall, if you practice these things when you come back to doing workshop butts it will be so much easier
try to only weld with gaunlet gloves not TIG gloves, it will be hard at first but when you get used to it you will love it
as I said previously I never use TIG gloves for welding pipe, I will use them on my wire hand if I am using 1mm filler wire

Keep in touch
R
Flash

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